RE: Hardfork 21 - Steem Proposal System (SPS) + Economic Improvement Proposal (EIP)

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RE: Hardfork 21 - Steem Proposal System (SPS) + Economic Improvement Proposal (EIP)

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sepracore in #hf21 • 6 years ago

One of your best counterpoints to those against the hardfork changes is ... it isn’t like it is working now! We need something different. I agree the hardfork is unlikely the perfect package but it is possibly better than what we have now and at worst it will just be more of the same. I am not exactly a fan of the mentality of “let’s just try it and see what happens” but at the same time we are just bleeding a slow death so let’s change it up. If it horrific, we can always go back or try something else.

My primary concern with the hardfork is getting proper funding for the Steem proposal system. We need that funded. I am ok with pulling it from inflation. We have to have it to stay competitive and keep this chain advancing, especially as other chains come along. So critical. How would you like to see the SPS funded?

6 years ago in #hf21 by sepracore

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timcliff 6 years ago

I was personally leaning towards pulling a little bit from each of the three inflation sources (rewards pool, SP interest, and witness pay) so that the SPS had around 10% of the inflation. The consensus though seems to be more leaning towards just taking 10% from the rewards pool. Again, it's not my personal top choice - but I'm OK enough with it to support it if that is what everyone decides.

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preparedwombat 6 years ago

I was personally leaning towards pulling a little bit from each of the three inflation sources (rewards pool, SP interest, and witness pay) so that the SPS had around 10% of the inflation. The consensus though seems to be more leaning towards just taking 10% from the rewards pool.

The consensus being among Top 20 Witnesses who would prefer that none of that 10% come from witness pay? 🤔

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timcliff 6 years ago (edited)

It was discussed at length. My 'vote' was technically for a 10% reduction in witness pay too (as well as SP inflation). The main reason against it though (that I do agree with) is that it affects backup witness pay too, and a lot of the backup witnesses are already running at a loss.

One of the nice things about the SPS, is that once we have a funding source in place, it is then possible for the community to fund changes. If someone wants to make a proposal to the SPS to fund development + testing for a change that increases backup witness pay, decreases top witness pay, and adds more funding to the SPS - that is fair game.

If the system works as expected / hoped, then we basically have a framework for these types of improvements.

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indigoocean 6 years ago

Is there no way to restrict the reduction to only top-20 witness rewards?

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timcliff 6 years ago

It is possible, although it would be more development for Steemit, more things to test, which would mean more time before the fork. There is already a lot of pushback from the hardfork containing too many changes. At this point, most of us want to get something out the door so we can start working within an improved system. There will always be the option of making more tweaks later (such as updates to witness pay), and after the hardfork - we will have a SPS to pay for such things.

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sepracore 6 years ago

Will the backup witnesses still run at a loss with the implementation of MIRA? I assume the effective pay of all witnesses should increase in the near future since your cost will decrease?

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timcliff 6 years ago

Time will tell. From what I've heard, it will not have much of an impact on the costs for consensus (witness) nodes. It's a bigger deal for 'full' nodes and exchanges.

https://steemit.com/steem-pressure/@gtg/steem-pressure-6-mira-ymmv-rtfm-tldr-lgtm

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gtg 6 years ago

IMHO if top20 witness is not running at loss at this moment then they are doing something wrong ;-)
Hardware costs are negligible compared to time/effort spent to make Steem awesome.

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gtg 6 years ago

Yes, and I'm one of those. Witnesses are also SP holders, authors and curators.
Currently for one to fund some project, a viable way of getting funds is to post about it and get it from rewards anyway. It is an equivalent to ask people to allocate a vote to a project that will add a value to the platform.

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indigoocean 6 years ago

Kind of like how Congress always votes Congress a raise. Yeah, not expecting too many witnesses to volunteer themselves for a pay-cut, even if it would be the more "fair and balanced" way to go.

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timcliff 6 years ago

I was up for it, but again - the main thing was that it would affect backup witnesses too.

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indigoocean 6 years ago

Yeah I know you said you support 1/3s, but I doubt a majority would vote to decrease their pay even if those below 20 were excluded. Such are our times.

Posted using Partiko iOS

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sepracore 6 years ago

As long as it comes from somewhere, that is a great thing. Thanks for your update.

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mitrado (1) 6 years ago

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iflagtrash 6 years ago

I flag trash (and morons). You have received a flag.

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